03-17-2012 at 10:40 PM

Many of my high TP dogs (3k and up) are way over 100 (or used to be before I got more sessions lately). So they would get health issues and would have issues reaching Otis :) Mostly I grabbed them up cheap and speed trained them when they were already over 80 or so. <br /> <br /> <br /> I see now what you mean with the high TP dogs making less money. But wouldn't they win a lot more often than the lower TP dogs still? <br /> <br /> But really, those super high entry fees make it ineffective to trial anything but capped dogs - but if everyone would trial capped dogs, it would also be pointless *scratching head* <br /> <br /> Another big issue I noted since yesterday with the whole "just two dogs" problem - trials don't run for ages, including your own. Some people see it fit to throw their own monster in your trials, which you can't compete with, and then your trials are stuck. Considering how many more trails you'll need anyway, most of which will likely take long to run at Odie and above, how much more auto trials is Ala going to create? Or do we get to make a lot more trials? <br /> <br />

03-17-2012 at 9:46 AM

Jambers - Just because someone has a different opinion than you does not mean they are throwing a fit. We are trying to figure out how to fix the trial system and exploring different alternatives. Everyone here has offered some sort of idea to try to help fix the issue, except you, who has posted almost nothing in here except "stop complaining" to other users.<br /> <br /> The problem with the trial system is it's dumping too much money into capped dog owners pockets and causing the inflation. It's great that they spent the money to cap their dog but it ISN'T great they are destroying the overall economy by trialing them. Saying that others should cap their dogs in order to "stay in the ranks" is not going to make inflation go down.

03-17-2012 at 5:16 AM

Seconding Jambers. People shouldn't be crippled because they are able to afford Aviator Caps and Soldier Helmets. They're good at saving their money and I commend them for it.

03-17-2012 at 5:02 AM

Im sorry but really? Does it really matter how much money a person puts into a dog to get it to win? If it wins then it wins. Say congradulations and move on, dont pout because "well they used a MFB" "its not right they have those gogles" "Its the SH falt.." <br /> <br /> It is right, its there stuff let them use it. If you want something look for it, ask around. Save your money and get it. do not throw a fit because they are using their money to improve their game.

03-16-2012 at 6:40 PM

<i>"It is, obviously, about dogs with lower TP (and I'm not talking foundations) being worthless after a while because you are forced to go to a higher level, while the capped dogs just go on and on. They CAN'T stay in the lower levels, that's just one of the points."</i><br /> <br /> All dogs, no matter the TP (excluding the over-the-cap dogs) end up like this. This is why I stopped trialing my two capped dogs that hit Gromit already.<br /> <br /> <br /> <i>"Add to that that, for most of us not owning lots of trial monsters, getting our dogs so high despite them being low TP is part of the fun. I got 2 of my customs to Marley. I'm super happy about that, even if they lost money in the process. It takes work to do that, not just randomly enter some capped dogs."</i><br /> <br /> Though it's cool that you were able to do this, this is not how agility trials on Alacrity were made to work.<br /> <br /> <br /> <i>"I don't get this. Why would the higher dogs make any less money?"</i><br /> <br /> Okay, let's think of a reasonable trial winning for a LOW-TP dog. Low-TP dogs do not take as much money, time and effort into getting them maxed, therefore their trial winnings would not be very high, right? Let's set it at around $5000 for 1st place. Now, capped/higher-TP dogs are not worth maxing and trialing because it's easier to just max a low-TP dog and go on with your day. A capped dog making $5000 (fixed trial winning) will not make that money back in a reasonable time-frame and it wouldn't be worth it to max a capped dog for any reason.<br /> <br /> <br /> <i>"Breeding for TP has become somewhat pointless anyway, as there are so many capped dogs out there already and not much else to go for."</i> <br /> <br /> Not entirely. Higher-TP dogs are worth more, win more in trials and like you said with your customs in Marley... it's fun to reach a goal.<br /> <br /> <br /> <i>"The only challenge is to train them with as low cost as possible before they get too old and then hope they still make it to at least Marley :-)"</i><br /> <br /> All of my capped dogs reach at least Otis, what are you talking about "at least Marley"?

03-16-2012 at 4:27 PM

Probably, but to get much over the cap with just trialing bonuses is taking a while, and not too many people add aviator caps and pay for soldier helmets when the dogs can't even give the bonus to their parents. <br /> <br />

03-16-2012 at 11:20 AM

<i>"The über-TP dogs are another matter altogether. But as their offspring is 'only' capped and they eventually can't trial anymore it is not that much of a problem I think."</i><br /> <br /> I completely forgot immortal dogs stop trialing at 20 years. XD My bad. Won't there always be dogs pushing beyond the cap and doing the exact same thing though?

03-16-2012 at 11:09 AM

The über-TP dogs are another matter altogether. But as their offspring is 'only' capped and they eventually can't trial anymore it is not that much of a problem I think. <br /> <br /> Fixed entry fee/fixed winnings would be a lot more like RL, too. Just because my dog is a super well bred shep does not mean he would win more than the ugly cross eyed mutt who happens to have a good day :-)

03-16-2012 at 10:43 AM

<i>"Maybe if we'd have fixed entrance fees and fixed winnings (different for the placings maybe) and the option to decide what level we'd enter our dogs, it would all level out."</i><br /> <br /> Actually I kind of like this idea. Instead of winnings being based off TP they should be a set amount for each trial level. That way a capped dog competing in, let's say Odie, will be making the same as a low level dog in that some category. (More realistic this way too.) Capped dogs supposedly zoom right through the trials so they'll get up to those higher paying ranks very quickly. <br /> <br /> I'm not going to touch the "decide what level we'd enter our dogs" part since it goes back to TP sectioning and there is already a debate on that. :P<br /> <br /> Right now it isn't even worth it to breed to the cap, imo. Let's say I bred my dogs to 8999 and now they can't go any higher without certain items. They can't be guarenteed wins if they don't go higher than that. What do I do? Do I invest my money to get items that would exploit the cap glitch? (Which I personally think is cheating. Cap = an upper limit on what is allowed. That means they shouldn't be able to go over that limit, in my opinion.)<br /> <br /> This is the way I look at it. Let's use Rosencrown for an example since s/he was brought up earlier. This dog has 24k TP (could have sworn it was 20k yesterday. I'm half asleep so I maybe wrong. o.o) while the 2nd top dog has only 18k. Unless you have an absolutely absurd amount of bones or real money to spend, no one will <b>ever</b> be able to catch up with that dog. In fact, even if you DO have that much money and time on hand it won't matter. Certain items like aviator caps (which were used in this case) can't even be found. (Aren't like 10% of them owned by the same person too?) If I never have a shot at winning, ever, then why even bother putting all my time and effort into it?<br /> <br /> The whole low tp vs high tp thing seems to be going around in circles. At the end of the day it is the capped dogs causing the inflation by raking in too much cash. Perhaps Doom's suggestion is the way to go.

03-16-2012 at 8:18 AM

*sigh* It is NOT about high level dogs being worth more. It is, obviously, about dogs with lower TP (and I'm not talking foundations) being worthless after a while because you are forced to go to a higher level, while the capped dogs just go on and on. They CAN'T stay in the lower levels, that's just one of the points. <br /> <br /> Add to that that, for most of us not owning lots of trial monsters, getting our dogs so high despite them being low TP is part of the fun. I got 2 of my customs to Marley. I'm super happy about that, even if they lost money in the process. It takes work to do that, not just randomly enter some capped dogs. You need to make sure you enter the right dogs in the right teams. I read some only trial customs and see how high they would get. To take away teams is to take away half the fun for at least a few people. <br /> <br /> "This would just end up in one way, low-tp dogs making too much & high-tp making too little and making high-tp not worth the effort put into them (thus making the drive to breed for higher-tp dogs on Ala useless)."<br /> <br /> I don't get this. Why would the higher dogs make any less money? They would go on as they do now. Or maybe you mean because they can't rush over the lower TP dogs in the high levels anymore and thus you'd need 5 capped dogs in one trial. I guess it would come down to speed and drive then. But that would make those stats more useful again which would be cool. <br /> <br /> Breeding for TP has become somewhat pointless anyway, as there are so many capped dogs out there already and not much else to go for. Once you have capped dogs you always have them, it is not a challenge. The only challenge is to train them with as low cost as possible before they get too old and then hope they still make it to at least Marley :-)<br /> <br />

03-16-2012 at 7:28 AM

<i>"By that logic, you can just forget about trialing at all because non-capped dogs would probably not even make it to Toto."</i><br /> <br /> I don't understand where you're going here. What I'm saying is lower-tp dogs generally stay in the lower trial levels (where they should be, because of their TP) when users aren't (in my honest opinion) cheating to boost their low-tp dogs through the ranks. I currently see dogs with one tenth the TP of my capped dogs.. fighting against my capped dogs in Otis. Yes, you read that right, and the only reason they're so high is because the users team-trial them.<br /> <br /> <br /> <i>"I think this is the most broken part of the trials , that dogs become worthless after a while, no matter how high the TP."</i><br /> <br /> I don't know why you believe this. Higher-tp dogs will always be worth more than lower-tp dogs.<br /> <br /> <br /> <i>"Maybe if we'd have fixed entrance fees and fixed winnings (different for the placings maybe) and the option to decide what level we'd enter our dogs, it would all level out."</i><br /> <br /> This would just end up in one way, low-tp dogs making too much & high-tp making too little and making high-tp not worth the effort put into them (thus making the drive to breed for higher-tp dogs on Ala useless).

03-16-2012 at 6:48 AM

Eh, those a high TP dogs. They should be able to make some of the money back put into them. <br /> <br /> By that logic, you can just forget about trialing at all because non-capped dogs would probably not even make it to Toto. <br /> <br /> I think this is the most broken part of the trials , that dogs become worthless after a while, no matter how high the TP. <br /> <br /> This is not like RL at all. In RL, your dog simply would not go to the next level of trials. My friend could just decide not to run her beagle mix in the higher trials, knowing she wouldn't make it there. But I have no choice. Would I prefer to have my non-capped dogs (as in almost all of them) stay in the lower levels? Sure, there they win at least sometimes, even if not in teams. But I do not have this choice, and that makes some of the effort put into non-capped monsters and monsterlets a bit pointless. <br /> <br /> Maybe if we'd have fixed entrance fees and fixed winnings (different for the placings maybe) and the option to decide what level we'd enter our dogs, it would all level out.

03-16-2012 at 6:00 AM

<i>"But with the changes, those two dogs will not be worth anything anymore. "</i><br /> <br /> <br /> Chances are they wouldn't be there without teaming, in that case, they were never meant to make it that far anyways.

03-16-2012 at 5:45 AM

Sorry, not on much...,<br /> <br /> What I meant is, you already get less money if your 5k TP dog wins something as opposed to a capped dog winning. So a capped dog will of course always be worth a lot more. <br /> <br /> But I have non-capped dogs at Gromit now. They can't win anymore so I froze them in the hopes of getting a team eventually. But with the changes, those two dogs will not be worth anything anymore.

03-14-2012 at 4:05 PM

Oh boy<br /> <br /> <i>"I'm not sure what constitutes a reasonable amount of time for you. Reasonable in regards to the amount of TP being maxed or just your own personal time-frame?"</i><br /> <br /> How long the dog takes to be maxed, of course. This varies with how many sessions a user has per day, what energy companion(s), a rejuvenator or not, scholar collar, timewarp, etc. I have around 150 per day with a Baby T-Rex and rejuvenator. I can max a HALF-MAXED, capped dog in a minimum of one month. That's not reasonable in my opinion.<br /> <br /> <br /> <i>"If you bought a MWB, it was to use on your capped dog, yes? MWB's used to be a lot cheaper, so yes, people could buy them without already having a maxed, capped dog."</i><br /> <br /> I bought my first MWB for more than a million $$.<br /> <br /> <br /> <i>"You said that you had 2 dogs that had reached the Gromit level. The requirement for a dog to be in that bracket is that they have 700 or more wins. Unless the dogs you mentioned aren't at Gromit level, if you are saying they don't have that many wins?"</i><br /> <br /> You have to factor in the amount of times the dog has lost and entry fees were wasted.<br /> <br /> <br /> <i>"Yes, low level dogs running against low level dogs is great. But that doesn't happen as often as it could."</i><br /> <br /> How do you figure? Low-tp dogs will be fighting against low-tp in the lower levels. A capped dog zooms through the lower level and usually gets stuck in Otis for a long time. The lower levels are very, very, very short. You can move the capped dog through multiple levels in one day if you help your dog gain energy.<br /> <br /> <br /> <i>"A person has to be a bit bonkers to enter their dog in first in a trial and expect it to place once the race runs. You're complaining about your 9k dog being beaten out by 12k's and saying that's why you don't trial anymore?"</i><br /> <br /> I'm not complaining, I'm just stating that it's not worth trialing my 8999.91TP dogs in Gromit when they are fighting against 12K TP dogs. What do I do about this? I don't sit down and mope and cry about people "sniping" or "playing unfairly".... I try and get higher capped dogs. When I finish my capped pit line (which will take a LONG time because I'm doing it by myself) I will use Soldier Helmets so I can compete against the "big dogs" in Gromit.<br /> This is just like the little dog owners complaining about their dogs not beating the higher-tp dogs. Complaining about it will get them nowhere, working to get past the big dogs will get them somewhere. Alacrity is not a game where things are handed on a plate - you have to WORK for them. This includes WORKING your dogs to get past the big dogs. This is the same for any competition on the face of the planet.<br /> <br /> <br /> <i>"I do have to wonder about that 20k TP dog. Every time it runs it's TP is going up a bit. And every time those Aviator caps skill-up it rises even higher. It could be that all 60+ of those aviator caps can actually keep that dog running and profiting for a *really* long time since it's score is always increasing. Another question I have is, where did all the money to spend on that dog even come from? :P"</i><br /> <br /> Probably saving it up. I cannot speak for Jackdaw but I commend her for being able to work so hard to get her dog where it is now.<br /> <br /> <br /> <i>"And, I think the price to max a capped dog is going to vary. The prices of those items aren't always constant, and a person can always cut deals and trade for what they need... without spending bones/Ala cash. Let's not pretend like MWB's have always been worth $6 million or so... that's a very recent change."</i><br /> <br /> Of course they haven't, they've been stuck around $2-3 million. Trust me, I was searching for MWB for weeks and months. <br /> This is why I haven't been maxing any more capped dogs. Spending $2-3 million is a bit of a rip off in my opinion. I used to buy MFB and max the rest myself (takes 1 month) but once the MFB got taken out of the shops, I hoarded a bunch and stopped trying. It's just not worth the time and money (if I had no MFB.. seeing as though they're up there in price as well) to max a dog either way anymore.

03-14-2012 at 3:53 PM

Jack don't get me wrong. It's not a punishment as you claim it would be. You are still getting bonuses for keeping money in the bank. All the other sites I've been on that have the bank/interest feature don't nearly give out as much money as Alacrity's does. How much in interest do you make a week? Is it a reasonable amount or is it outrageous? I'm sure it's outrageous. I like saving myself. I enjoy saving and seeing my money grow but even I think the interest is a little too high.<br /> <br /> I dont think anyone should be punished but eventually that money will weed its way into the game. Some people buy things with only their interest and I did that for awhile. I think you are missing my whole entire point.

03-14-2012 at 2:56 PM

You are welcome to do the math in concerns to proof, as the information is available. It is not possible not because I choose to tell you so, but that it is mathematically not possible to earn it back.<br /> <br /> The items have nothing to do with the dog itself in value, as they are an independent property once purchased with no intention of resale. As would any other item be in my (or your) inventory that is not equipped on a dog and not to be sold.<br /> <br /> A great deal of money was personally made prior to the capped dog increase and economic imbalance. Granted different methods were employed, though there is no arguing it is easier to make more after the inflation issue. Which hopefully will be corrected with the rate of trialing somewhat slowed alongside more money sinks and activities introduced.<br /> <br /> I am not personally intrigued in the idea of punishing users for saving money and collecting weekly interest, as banked money is not affecting the rate of inflation by any significance in comparison to trialing vs. the prices of monthly shop and interested gathered.<br /> <br /> Though this is my own opinion, granted it may be taken as a biased one as I prefer not to spend money due to my affiliation to being a miserable miser.

03-14-2012 at 1:34 PM

I have to say that I'm a little disheartened when people can make over 50mil. I understand that it was earned but then I noticed a lot of these times the people with this much money have tried changing the site. I'm not going to mention one name of someone who suggested something months ago to slow people making money after she, herself, had reached over 50mil. It feels like those with huge chunks of money are able to get whatever they want on the site and have a say in the policies. I'm really not sure how to word what I'm feeling exactly. <br /> <br /> I know they earned it and I wouldn't want my money taken.. but it just seems too extreme. Someone that I was talking to earlier suggested putting a cap on the amount of interest that could accumulate. As opposed to getting over 1mil-3mil+ it would be capped at 500k. I actually think that would make more sense than for someone to have over, let's say.. 100mil and have ridiculous interest. <br /> <br /> I feel like in time things will work themselves out and the prices will adjust. At least I hope they will. I feel like the talk of ala and the real world's economy is getting stale and lots of ideas have already been exhausted. <br /> <br /> I don't know if I'm getting my point across or not xD.

03-14-2012 at 7:18 AM

Well, yeah. It's not hard to take advantage of the current inflation situation, if a person already has buyer/seller's knowledge of the item market, and is able to get their hands on a few items that are in demand to start out with (which comes from playing on here for a while... or getting lucky).<br /> <br /> The reason making a profit off bags is possible is due to the current high price of bones (caused by the surplus of Ala cash available). But that's another sign that there are problems here. I don't believe things are supposed to be that way. Think about it. A little over a month ago, we had $800 mill in circulation. The $200 mill you put into your dog is one quarter of that. That's a little general, because most likely the money you spent is stretched over a longer period of time. But still, that's kinda crazy.<br /> <br /> Like I said previously, I'm in no way blaming you for being able to amass that amount of money, but in a healthy economy, that's something that shouldn't really be possible to accomplish.<br /> <br /> I guess one of the reasons I'm skeptical when I hear that Rosen can't make back what was spent on her is because I haven't been shown actual proof. All I've been told is 'no that's not possible'. Also, unless the value of those aviator caps she's wearing suddenly depreciates, a big chunk of that money is still there. It's just locked up in items. That's actually a form of investment. It's similar to a person who buys property. They've exchanged their money for something that holds similar value.

03-14-2012 at 3:19 AM

Good business sense. I made most of my money reselling and old bone exchange.<br /> <br /> You can still make a fortune now by purchasing Ultimate monthly bags from the monthly shop, selling for 4-5 bones and reselling bones for $70,000-$80,000 each.<br /> <br /> It is not difficult to make money on Alacrity if you watch carefully, with or without trialing.<br /> <br /> Rosencrown was a project of passion for me and a large portion of my savings went into it. Needless to say I will not be making it back.<br /> <br /> This is beside the current trial topic, but it seemed worth mentioning since it was volunteered into the conversation. I don't think there is any reason why I should not be able to make an amount as it shows other users are perfectly capable of doing it as well.